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Proposed Hotel Spurs Petition Drive

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A Facebook page called Vote Against Oakbrook Plaza Rezoning to Hotel and a related online petition have put a spotlight on two upcoming public hearings for a Candlewood Suites hotel that is under construction in the the shopping plaza at the southwest corner of McMullen Booth Road and Enterprise Drive. Here’s what you need to know about this issue:

What is being proposed?

KOS Corp. has submitted to the city a site plan modification for a 58,093-square-foot Candlewood Suites hotel that will use the same footprint as the previous building, with the addition of a swimming pool. The hotel will have not more than 72 rooms on three stories, and meet all other Safety Harbor requirements for hotels. Candlewood Suites is one of 13 hotel brands, including Holiday Inn, owned by InterContinental Group. According to InterContinental Group’s website, Candlewood Suites “offer a more casual kind of longer stay, where you’ll always feel at home, at your best and really productive while on the road.”

A Candlewood Suites is proposed for this parcel in Oakbrook Plaza at the corner McMullen Booth Road and Enterprise Drive. (Scott Long)

Who is opposed and what are they asking residents to do?

In comments on a post on the Vote Against Oakbrook Plaza Rezoning to Hotel Facebook page, Susie Adriance, who lives in Northwood Estates, identified herself as being the leader of the movement, which includes a petition on ThePetitionSite.com. The group is asking residents to sign the petition, attend the two upcoming public hearings and contact elected officials in Safety Harbor, Clearwater and Pinellas County.

Isn’t that land in Clearwater?

Because it is on the west side of McMullen Booth Road, it’s a common misconception that it is in Clearwater. While the businesses in all four shopping centers at the intersection have Clearwater mailing addresses, only the shopping center with a Publix is in the City of Clearwater. The other three are in Safety Harbor.

Isn’t that parcel already zoned to allow hotels?

The Vote Against Oakbrook Plaza Rezoning to Hotel Facebook page is urging residents to sign a petition and contact City Commissioners.

Yes, so this is not a rezoning request as the Facebook page says, but rather a site plan major modification to change the land use on a portion of the site from “office/retail” to “hotel.” On May 5, 2014, the Safety Harbor Commission, which at the time consisted of Mayor Andy Steingold, Vice Mayor Cliff Merz and Commissioners Andy Zodrow, Carlos Diaz and Rick Blake, voted 5-0 to add “hotels” as a permitted use in C1-A (‘restricted commercial district”) zones. The ordinance included a number of provisions that essentially limited hotels to the McMullen Booth/Enterprise intersection, and established a series of requirements, including that all hotel rooms open only to an interior hallway. According to the meeting minutes, Zodrow expressed concern about adding more allowable uses, but reluctantly supported the ordinance because he said a hotel is not inconsistent with the types of businesses in the area. Merz said he, too, had concerns, but felt they had been addressed. Zodrow, Merz and Diaz are still on the Commission.

So what is a “site plan major modification to change the land use”?

The land at the northwest corner of Oakbrook Plaza, which previously housed Roadie’s Restaurant among other retail establishments, is presently designated in the “office/retail” future land-use category on the approved site plan. Since this portion of the development most recently was used as “office/retail,” part of the site plan process is to change the land use to “hotel,” which is allowed per the 2014 vote.

When are the public hearings?

There are two. The matter will first come before the city’s Planning & Zoning Board at 6:30 p.m. on Wednesday (click here for the agenda and backup materials), and the final decision will be made by the City Commission at its July 16 meeting at 7 p.m. Both meetings will be at City Hall at 750 Main St. Members of the public will have an opportunity to comment at both hearings. The City Commission hearing will be what is called “quasi-judicial hearing.” The hearings will mimic a courtroom process in some ways, with “affected parties,” including city staff and representatives of KOS Corp., being sworn in and able to cross-examine each other. Some hearings include a court reporter. There is a strict set of considerations Commissioners must make their decision based on, and their decision must be based solely on “competent and substantial” evidence provided during the hearing. The city offers a brochure detailing the quasi-judicial process for residents who wish to learn more about the process.

Can the hotel be stopped?

In a technical sense, yes. Commissioners are always free to vote however they wish. But in a practical sense, it will be an uphill battle. The site plan modification application appears to meet all city codes” and adheres to the city’s zoning that allows for a hotel on the property. For Commissioners to vote against the site plan modification, contrary “competent and substantial evidence” must be presented at the Commission hearing.

40 Comments

  1. I moved out of Clearwater High School neighborhood because drug dealers and prostitutes set up shop in the new yet slightly run down Ramada Limited Clearwater Hotel and Suites. Located within a half mile of Clearwater High School. The crime spread in our residential area and we got out. Now you want to build next to my new home and kid’s new school… here we go again. PS there is no parking. PSS- Scientology likes to bring drug addicts into the area for treatment, I’m sure they will look at this extended stay as a great asset, as Scientology is the biggest business in Clearwater bringing in travelers from all over the world that don’t mind living in a parking lot at a strip mall while under going Scientology drug programs.

    • A brand new Candlewood Suites hotel in Safety Harbor will not bring in drug dealers, prostitutes, and Scientology drug addicts. These comments are simply lies and scare tactics that have already been discredited at the original Planning and Zoning Board meeting. This new hotel will accommodate business people, tourists, sports fans, hospital workers, relocating nurses and doctors, and visiting families and friends of local residents. The Candlewood Suites hotel is a professionally run business that will dramatically improve Oakbrook Plaza and will raise the property values of the nearby Clearwater neighborhoods. A new hotel will also bring in much needed tax revenue that will help improve our infrastructure, roads, schools, parks, libraries, etc., and will be a win-win for everyone in our area.

      • It really is unfortunate to have a lower end property proposed. It is too bad the location would not work for a lovely small boutique hotel. There is not a five star Four Seasons or Ritz Carlton in the area. I realize that location would never work for a 5 star…I guess they will have to stay with a property that fits well into the strip mall environment.

  2. During Wednesday’s P & Z Board meeting, I also saw efforts by attendees at the meeting to intimidate our P & Z Board members. Just before the meeting began, at least a 100 people from Clearwater entered our small Commission room filling up every seat and standing several deep against the walls. Soon after the meeting began, one after another began to tell our P & Z board members that our proposed new $7 million hotel was going to attract criminals, thieves, prostitution, child molesters, drug dealers, cases of domestic battery, poor people, welfare recipients, vagrants, etc. These unsubstantiated and ridiculous claims went on for several hours. Only three Safety Harbor Residents even spoke at all.
    Many of these Clearwater residents were very angry and threatened that if they didn’t get their way at the P & Z Board, they weren’t going to stop. They all said that they were all coming back to Safety Harbor’s July 16th commission meeting with many more people next time. They are also passing around a petition to stop our new hotel, and are contacting elected officials in the City of Clearwater and even in Pinellas County.
    It is interesting that these Clearwater residents kept referring to problems they have at extended stay hotels in their own city, but none of them appeared concerned enough to go to their own city council and deal with their own problems. They were solely focused on stopping a nice new hotel in the city of Safety Harbor. It is also interesting to note that I have never heard of a Safety Harbor resident ever going to the Clearwater city council and telling them what hotels they should be allowed to have in their city. We are a small city and it certainly feels like we are being bullied by our much larger neighbors to the west. This is Safety Harbor’s issue to decide and I am bothered by the fact that hundreds of Clearwater residents are planning to pile into our July 16th commission meeting and will try to intimidate our mayor and commissioners in the same way that they did to our P & Z board members.

    • The reason for the large group of Clearwater residents at the meeting is proximity. Most Safety Harbor residents were not notified of the request for land use change. It is hard to even understand how this property is in Safety Harbor, it would seem logically to be part of Clearwater.

      It appears that the Hotel project in question will proceed. As a nearby resident I sincerely hope it is better operated and maintained than the rest of Oakbrook Plaza. In the 35 years I have lived here Oakbrook has consistently been a blemish on an otherwise upscale community.

      • I agree that the proposed Candlewood Suites hotel will most likely be approved by our city commission, as it should be. Under our zoning laws, a hotel is a permitted use at this location. If our city commission refuses to approve this hotel when it is allowed under our municipal codes, it will likely result in a lawsuit by the developer against our city. Safety Harbor will most likely lose this lawsuit and will then be forced to pay a substantial amount in damages and legal fees. In the meantime, we will all have to suffer with having an ugly unfinished steel framed structure that will diminish the appearance of the Oakbrook Plaza.
        An new multi-million dollar Candlewood Suites hotel will only enhance the Plaza and the surrounding neighborhoods. Safety Harbor is a wonderful small city with strong code enforcement laws. We would never tolerate crime, prostitution, drug dealing, etc. at this new hotel in our city. The neighboring Clearwater residents should embrace this new hotel which will certainly raise their area’s property values and bring in visitors who will pay taxes and support the nearby businesses and restaurants.

  3. I understand the frustrations of Clearwater residents but after reading up on the situation, it met all the requirements of the permitted use and the Board Members had to vote accordingly. I, as a Safety Harbor resident don’t want our city to have a lawsuit on our hands by denying something based on resident claims that are subjective. I’d rather see any potential lawsuit money put towards saving the Baranoff Oak.

    I’m also very discouraged via the lying that occurred after the meeting with Facebook posts such as people were not allowed to speak, etc. This was totally false. Every individual who wanted to speak was allowed. The woman behind Saving Safety Harbor has continued to cause trouble for multiple years with her cyberbullying and posts in our town. She has a history from other states. She needs to move on. Our city needs peace.

  4. The planning and zoning board had a difficult task with regard to the Oakbrook Plaza. The meeting was standing room only, filled with mostly Clearwater residents and neighbors of the Oakbrook Plaza, who were in opposition to an “extended stay” hotel. Since the building, hotel use and site plan meet all requirements of the permitted use, finding a reason for denial is difficult.
    Saving Safety Harbor posted the decision and then listed all six members of the board, just minutes after the meeting ended. What is the purpose of such a post other than attempting to intimidate the members and attempting to incite anger toward those members? Ms Schellenberg is trying to defend the action as mere sharing of public information. We all know it was deplorable intimidation. In the wake of a recent threat to the Mayor on this Facebook page, I fear for the safety of our board members. Our board volunteers should not be subjected to such cyber bullying, and this site continues this behavior while inflaming readers’ emotions with misleading and incomplete information.
    Thank you Mayor for addressing the topic of cyber bullying. I believe it is possible to discuss issues and viewpoints, based on facts, without disrespectful attacks or threats to residents.

  5. I work for a top 20 Fortune 500 company, in management, and guess what? Many of us stay in extended stay hotels during our extended trips. In fact my first trips to Tampa before relocating were in extended stay hotels, a week at a time, two different occasions. I was in the company of other business travelers from various companies as well as two families in town for family members in the hospital, and some families on vacation. The hysteria at the meeting was uncalled for especially since the decision at hand can not be decided based on the local resident opposition.

  6. Thank you Scott for the update.
    Business travelers and tourists do not stay in extended stay hotels. The folks that will stay in this type of hotel will not be frequenting our local businesses. These type of units cater to folks on the low end of the economic spectrum who rent rooms by the week or the month. They generally require mass transportation which is another issue altogether.
    I find it interesting that Saftey Harbor turned down luxury apartments and now it considering an extended stay hotel.
    Another interesting observation, if you look up the mailing addresses say for Walgreens, McDonalds and Bonefish Grill they all show as Clearwater not Saftey Harbor.

    • Contrary to your fact free claims, business travelers and tourists do stay at extended stay hotels. My wife and I are professionals who have traveled extensively. We have stayed at extended stay hotels many times in the past. Visitors who stay at extended stay hotels usually have their own cars and they spend a lot of money patronizing local businesses and restaurants.
      Your false narrative that only poor people use extended stay hotels was discredited last night at the P & Z Board meeting. The hotel developers explained that the nightly room rates will be between $110 and $165.00 plus taxes. The Candlewood Suites hotel that is proposed for Safety Harbor will be a professionally managed hotel that will cater to our local hospital employees, doctors, nurses, business people, professors, and visitors to our area. You are simply spreading lies and misinformation about extended stay hotels by using unfounded scare tactics about poor people who use public transportation.
      Also, you are wrong that Safety Harbor turned down luxury apartments at the Firmenich property. The luxury apartments proposed on the Firmenich property was approved by the Safety Harbor Commission by a 3-2 vote in February 2013. It was the Pinellas County Commission, whose approval was also needed, that denied the zoning amendment change to the 35-acre site from industrial to residential use.

    • I’m not exactly your low end business traveler and I stay in extended stay hotels. I travel 2-3 weeks a month and stay in a lovely extended stay hotel in Palm Beach Gardens 2 weeks a month and another extended stay in Hilton Head SC. Both are surrounded by million dollar homes and are in strip centers with multiple restaurants. I patronize those restaurants too. I don’t have a limited travel budget and still chose to stay in the extended stay hotels. Please don’t stereotype people.

    • Tourists and businesspersons alike certainly do utilize this type of lodging. If you’ve ever visited the Orlando area you have seen scores of similar properties. When I’ve traveled on business I’ve chosen extended stay properties … even for just a few days. The decision to allow or not should be on the basis of what’s in the best interest of Safety Harbor … not special interest groups and persons living in Clearwater.

  7. I attended the Planning and Zoning Board meeting with a mostly open mind (always a bit of healthy skepticism). After listening to what everyone had to say at the public hearing, I concluded that the proposed hotel would be a good and practical use of the large, existing building located in a successful commercial node. The gutted, 3-story building will be modernized, new trees will be planted, nearby retail/restaurant/service businesses stand to benefit, and the hotel will target a strong local market for business/tourism/sports/medical/family-related travel (as Joe C. points out above) using professionally certified marketing staff. Fear and emotion are natural initial reactions to change but we must allow space for logic and reason to inform our opinions/decisions. I feel that this hotel, like our in-town hotels, will be a good commercial neighbor that adds value to our shared community.

  8. It is good news to hear that the Planning and Zoning board unanimously passed the site plan modification for the proposed construction of a new Candlewood Suites hotel at Oakbrook Plaza. Having a brand new hotel at this site will significantly improve the appearance of Oakbrook Plaza and will benefit Safety Harbor and the nearby Clearwater neighborhoods. The $7 million dollar additional investment in this property will bring new employment, enhance our economy, and generate significant additional tax revenue for the city of Safety Harbor.
    The developers of this new hotel indicated last night that they plan to work closely with the local hospitals to fill the rooms with relocating hospital employees, doctors and nurses, and family members of hospital patients in need temporary housing. We also need additional housing for tourists, business people, and visiting local residents’ family and friends. Housing is also needed for the many visitors coming here to see the Philadelphia Phillies during Spring Training. Finally, Nova Southeastern University is building a new medical school at the corner of South Bayshore and Gulf to Bay Blvd. Relocating teachers, students, and their family members will also benefit from this new hotel. Having a new Candlewood Suites hotel in our city is a win-win for everybody.

  9. WHO WOULD SPEND ANY TIME COMPARING 49TH STREET TO THIS LOCATION? ITS NOT EVEN CLOSE. WE NEED MORE ROOMS FOR TOURISTS IN THIS AREA. IF YOU BOUGHT A HOUSE BY A BUSY INTERSECTION FULL OF BUSINESSES YOU ONLY HAVE YOURSELF TO BLAME. MORE PROPERTY TAXES WILL BE PAID TO.

  10. Joe C. makes lots of good points about taxes, traffic, etc. While I would have no use for it, I would welcome having a decent new hotel nearer our city! Surely a lot of residents cannot house all of their family guests, and as it stands now, that means putting them up in hotels that are pretty far away….and even the closest of those are not in places where I’d like to put my friends or family! I support this location for a hotel.

  11. Paid stooges. Clearly a contrived “report” complete with scripted remarks. Extended stay lodging has no justification for development within a few hundred feet of existing individual residences. That the approved zoning use definitions were bypassed to selectively cater to one individual developers plans smells like collision to circumvent a previous carefully considered PUD framework. It smells like chonyism because that’s what it is. Change the zoning if hotel development is proper and justfied in close proximity to a residential area.

    • Uhhh…..there’s no residences out in that area. It’s a business park/strip mall.

      What on earth are you talking about?

    • Roger, Are you saying that anyone who disagrees with you is a paid stooge? The first sign that someone has lost the argument is usually when they start attacking people personally instead of attacking their arguments.
      I also can’t imagine a better location to put a hotel than in its currently proposed location. The Oakbrook Plaza is a commercially zoned location on the west side of McMullen Booth Rd. where there already exists a steel framed structure where the hotel is to be built.

  12. Thank you Scott Long for your informative and objective article. I am very grateful. I believe that the issue with this proposed site modification actually goes back to 2014. In March, April and May of 2014, the Planning and Zoning Board, and the then-current administrations, decided to approve Ordinance 2014-14. I am a local resident, and at that time, was not apprised of the Ordinance change which added “hotel” to C1-A restricted commercial use. If I was aware, I would have started my petition and outcry back then. Interestingly enough, the ordinance change, if you read the minutes from the Planning and Zoning Committee meeting 2/14/2014, and the subsequent City Commission Meetings of March3, March 17, April 21, and May 5th, initially affected only 3 properties in Safety Harbor. A site at 590 and McMullenBooth, Northwood Commons and Oakbrook Plaza. If you follow the progression of the meetings, the ordinance was tweaked and honed, until only the Oakbrook Plaza site fit the bill of C1-A appropriate for a hotel. So the ordinance change, instigated by the property owner, then the planning and zoning board, with the City Attorney chiming in the with proper legal reason for moving forward with the ordinance change, benefited only the property owner of Oakbrook Plaza. I feel that back in 2014, the commission had a duty to seek out impact studies and traffic studies, and more importantly, the opinions of communities and residents when they were initially considering changing the Ordinance. The only recourse, this late in the day, is blocking the site modification and perhaps calling into question the actions of the City Commissioners office back in 2014.
    Extended-stay hotels appeal to a subset of transient clientele seeking affordable semi-permanent housing solutions which allow circumvention of traditional longer-term lease application processes, i.e. no background checks, no credit checks, no reference checks, and no scrutiny or examination by a homeowner’s association. Extended-stays are, in some cases, associated with significantly increased criminal activities (drugs, prostitution, etc.) and police calls for service. I requested active calls for service from the Pinellas County Sheriff’s department for the Candlewood Suites at 49th street for the past year. 52 calls for service, including drugs, robberies, domestic violence, trespassers etc. A similar search of Extended Stay American on Roosevelt returned 48 calls for service for similar reasons. A cursory Google search for “Candlewood Suites Crime” will return 20 articles of burglary, sexual assault, drugs and murders at their locations. This location is .5 miles from Leila Davis Elementary School.
    I am a mom, a grandmother, a hardworking resident. I’ve lived here since 1993. I love our community. My intent with the petition was to alert and inform local residents about the changes the City of Safety Harbor wants to quietly bring to our community.
    Thank you for objectively printing the news of the issue in your publication.
    Warmest regards,
    Susie Adriance

    • A brand new hotel like the Candlewood Suites hotel will be a great benefit for the City of Safety Harbor. It will attract many visitors along with business people working temporarily in our area. These people will be spending money here and supporting our businesses and restaurants. Labeling visitors to this hotel as”transients” is ridiculous. All hotel stays are temporary and therefore could be labeled as “transients”. These Candlewood Suites hotels you cited have hundreds of people staying there every week and a relatively small number of calls are made to the police each year.
      Just as you googled “Candlewood Suites Crime”, I decided to google “Publix Supermarkets Crime”. Just as I suspected, there were lots of crime stories about shoplifting, assaults of women in parking lots, and attacks on customers using knives and guns. Even pepper spray was sprayed into women’s eyes as thieves stole their pocketbooks. Does this mean that we should close all Publix Supermarkets?
      It is my opinion that you are intentionally misrepresenting the Candlewood Suites Hotel and are spreading false rumors against this hotel. You need to stop spreading fear that a great crime wave is coming to Safety Harbor and should embrace this new business which will be investing millions of dollars into our community.

      • I work at a Residence Inn – the accusations against Candlewood Suites is an unfair judgement against the brand. Luxury hotels have issues. It happens. So pointing and discrediting the IHG brand shows your lack of logic and understand of the industry. Comparing it to areas with such as 49th Street is assuming that ALL Candlewood Suites will be experience the same issues. A very unfair judgment.
        The hotel will run how it’s managed.

        I embrace the growth – the ability for family members to have a convenient place to stay, perhaps when visiting Mom who is in assisted living. The sports teams that use Eddie C Moore for tournaments and for the spring training fans.
        Pinellas County experience over 52,million in bed tax in 2017. Its time for Safety Harbor to get a piece of the pie!

      • Joe, The crime wave will not be coming to Safety Harbor as you mockingly refer to it…..it most likely will be coming to the Hotel’s surrounding subdivisions which lie in Clearwater FL. This proposed hotel is quite removed from the Safety Harbor Residents, while it sits in the back yards of many Clearwater residents. I feel it is quite inconsiderate of Safety Harbor residents to inflict this quality of life change on their neighbors to the west. This gets to the crux of what is going on.

        • Contrary to your false and outrageous claims that a brand new multi-million dollar hotel will only bring in criminals, the developer explained at the recent P & Z meeting that this new hotel will be serving professionals, hospital workers, doctors, nurses, families of hospital patients, tourists, business people, and visiting families and friend of local residents. This new multi-million dollar hotel will be a great benefit for your neighborhood and will raise your property values. It will take an old ugly empty steel framed structure and turn it into a beautiful new hotel that will employ many people and bring in professions who will pay taxes and patronize all of our local businesses and restaurants.

    • Your statement of what extended stay attracts does not hold truth for all. It will attract what the city attracts. It will provide housing for traveling nurses and doctors, traveling sports teams, corporate clients that are traveling for major companies,

      You are fooling yourself if you think a five star luxury hotel doesn’t have criminal activity.

      I have worked for Hilton and Marriott at an executive level position for 25 years. I hane also worked for IHG. Hotels attract what the area attracts. So if you are located in a know drug and prostitution area – you may have that issue.

    • Seriously, no one reasonable can possibly think that a newly constructed, long stay facility on some of the most expensive land in the county. Yes, long stay facilities in run down buildings in seedy neighborhoods become crime centers…but that is because they already ARE in lousy areas. Something located there, even if we look down the road in 20 or 30 years, will NEVER be “cheap”, and no itinerant drug dealer is going to pay $500 to $1,000 per week to stay there. Your argument does not hold water…I suggest really THINKING about this, instead of just emotionally reacting.

    • I total agree with the above post from S.A. also would like to add that hotel clients will effect Clearwater residents that live next to the property in question. If Safety Harbor wants a hotel so bad put it east of McMullen booth!

  13. Safety Harbor residents should strongly support this proposed Candlewood Suites hotel on the west side of McMullen Booth Rd. adjacent to the City of Clearwater. Our city needs additional hotel rooms to accommodate all of the visitors and business people who come to visit and work in our area. A new hotel will bring employment to our city and the hotel will pay a significant amount of real estate taxes that will help reduce the real estate tax burden on our residential properties.

    Visitors and business people who stay at this hotel will also patronize our many businesses and restaurants. This hotel being across the street from the Publix shopping plaza will also not affect the traffic in any of our residential neighborhoods. A new hotel in Safety Harbor will be a win-win for everybody in our city.

    • Business travelers and tourists do not stay in extended stay hotels. The folks that will stay in this type of hotel will not be frequenting our local businesses. These type of units cater to folks on the low end of the economic spectrum who rent rooms by the week or the month. They generally require mass transportation which is another issue altogether.

      • Mauricio, I must respectfully disagree. I have stayed in this kind of hotel many times. The rooms have more space and typically a small kitchen area. They offer a higher level of convenience than a typical one or two day stay hotel. I like them, and so do many of our friends. By the way, my wife and I are on the middle to upper end of the economic spectrum.

      • Mauricio, business travelers and tourists are _exactly_ the type of people that stay in this type of extended stay hotel. Candlewood Suites isn’t the type of cheap motel you find along Gulf To Bay occupied by the homeless. Their location in Clearwater charges $123 _per night_. That’s over $3600 per month — not exactly catering to the homeless.

        It took me all of 1 minute to find that information…

      • You are totally wrong about low income people and extended stay. Some examples are: Folks buying a home here waiting for their new home to close. Folks that have family in the area they are visiting. Also the most important coming to town because a family member is in Mease Hospital. What extended stay means the rooms have a full kitchen (good for Publix and Winn Dixie), dining and sitting area. We stay at Candlewood suites when we travel bevause you are not cramped in a room. Also we are not low income.

      • A lot of the people staying in extended stay hotels are waiting for homes to be built, have just moved to the area & want to get a handle on the area before signing a lease and among other reasons are here on corporate training which requires more than couple of nights. So I am curious as to how you personally know “These type of units cater to folks on the low end of the economic spectrum who rent rooms by the week or the month.”? Were you one of the people you are referring to?

    • A: It is not “the city” that makes these decisions; it is “the citizens”. Are you calling them dumb?
      B: LOTS and lots of changes occur here, and lots of them are NOT opposed. But change DOES include risk, so people “pay attention”, and some people don’t like what they see as the risks.
      C: Attacking some generality about “progress” in an article about a single issue is “dumb”.

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